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Post by yitz on Jun 1, 2005 5:42:04 GMT -5
Maybe this has been mentioned ad nauseum here or elsewhere... if it has, feel free to delete the thread.
But has anyone noted the irony that Sith must kill their predecessor to become a Sith lord. Whereas Luke is told (by yoda ROTJ) his 'Jedi' training won't be complete until he kills a Sith Lord (Vader) ?
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Post by Ðreamreaver on Jun 1, 2005 8:26:57 GMT -5
I don't recall that. Yoda did tell him that he would have to face Vader eventually. That was pretty much a given anyway because Vader had, at that point, already hunted down most if not all of the jedi and killed them. From my recollection, Yoda told Luke his training was complete in ROTJ when Luke went back to Dagobah. At that point, Vader was still alive.
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xkamelx
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Post by xkamelx on Jun 1, 2005 13:03:30 GMT -5
RotJ
Luke: "So, I am a Jedi?"
Yoda: "Not yet. First you must confont Vader, then, a Jedi will you be, and face him you will."
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Post by Ðreamreaver on Jun 1, 2005 13:11:13 GMT -5
Ahh yes now I remember. He told Luke that there was nothing more that he could teach him but he would have to destroy Vader to become a jedi. It makes sense though because as long as Vader lived, the jedi would not have a chance of growing as he hunted them all down.
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Post by theartak on Jun 1, 2005 13:17:47 GMT -5
Wait, wait...hold up there. He never said destroy Vader. He said confront. Remember, Yoda knew Vader was Luke's father. He knew it would come about eventually. Luke would have to come to terms with his ancestry to accept his own role as a Jedi.
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Post by Ðreamreaver on Jun 1, 2005 13:27:30 GMT -5
You know Ar'tak now that you mention it, I think I recall wondering about that when I watched the films. Did Yoda know at that time that Luke had already faced Vader? He had already confronted him. By that basis, Luke was already a jedi wasn't he?
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Post by theartak on Jun 1, 2005 13:32:01 GMT -5
Nope. I personally have suspected it was tied in to two different things: Vader being Luke's father, and the cave. The cave fed off of fear. So, Luke not only had to find out his heritage, and deal with that, but he had to confront and face down his fear. Only then could he become a Jedi. Doesn't mean he has to destroy him.
That's also why Yoda didn't want Luke to go and face Vader when he did, because he knew Vader would use that against him, that he was his father. It's just a guess, but I think Yoda wanted him to find out some other way rather than in the middle of a fight...
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Post by Ðreamreaver on Jun 1, 2005 13:33:49 GMT -5
Yes you could be right. Man I really need to watch the trilogy again lol. I do agree that Yoda probably was referring to an inner confrontation rather than just a physical one.
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ConqueringWolf
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Post by ConqueringWolf on Jun 1, 2005 17:27:04 GMT -5
Luke was the one meant in the prophecy who would bring balance to the force.....or at least that's what I think. If you read the exact words as pointed out....he only said to confront Vade not destroy him. I think Luke helped bring balance back to the force when he got Vader to turn back to the good side and destroy the emperor. Luke completed his training and never did he actually kill vader....he simply turned him back away from the dark side.
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Post by Jax on Jun 11, 2005 21:26:15 GMT -5
Luke in a sense killed Vader. He turned him back into Anakin.
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pure
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Post by pure on Jun 12, 2005 8:36:58 GMT -5
Luke was the one meant in the prophecy who would bring balance to the force.....or at least that's what I think. If you read the exact words as pointed out....he only said to confront Vade not destroy him. I think Luke helped bring balance back to the force when he got Vader to turn back to the good side and destroy the emperor. Luke completed his training and never did he actually kill vader....he simply turned him back away from the dark side. no, when Anakin killed the jedi, he left two jedi and two sith...taht's a balanced force!
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Post by theartak on Jun 12, 2005 14:16:15 GMT -5
Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, pure. Short of Lucas' ever telling us what was running through his mind, no one can say who is right or wrong.
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xkamelx
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Post by xkamelx on Jun 12, 2005 16:57:45 GMT -5
If we take the Expanded universe into consideration, we can that Anakin brought balance when he tried to kil Palpatine, saved Luke and killed himself. Palpatine lived on in the EU, thus one Sith, one Jedi - Palpatine and Luke. Luke in a sense killed Vader. He turned him back into Anakin. Hi Jax, welcome to Temporal Reality.
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Post by Jax on Jun 12, 2005 22:25:17 GMT -5
Luke in a sense killed Vader. He turned him back into Anakin. Hi Jax, welcome to Temporal Reality. Thanks I'm just now starting to get into star wars (i've seen ep V and ep VI so far) I hope I can provide some good discussion
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Post by talon on Sept 23, 2005 6:39:12 GMT -5
I agree with Pure in that with the sith destroyed, the force would be swayed towards the jedi (good) and not balenced,
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